Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
demanderesse au fond
English translation:
meritorious plaintiff
Added to glossary by
Sophie Raimondo
May 14, 2015 21:48
9 yrs ago
18 viewers *
French term
demanderesse au fond
French to English
Law/Patents
Law (general)
Audience d'instruction et de jugement
Le demanderesse au fond, personellement assistee de ses conseils...
Proposed translations
(English)
4 | meritorious plaintiff | Germaine |
3 +1 | (US/civ.) plaintiff(s) at the full-trial stage | Adrian MM. (X) |
References
Meaning of "au fond" | Nikki Scott-Despaigne |
Proposed translations
22 hrs
Selected
meritorious plaintiff
What is MERITS? In practice. Matter of substance in law, as distinguished from matter of mere form; a substantial ground of defense in law. A defendant is said “to swear to merits” or “to make affidavit of merits” when he makes affidavit that he has a good and sufficient or substantial defense to the action on the merits… “Merits,” in this application of it, has the technical sense of merits in law… A “defense upon the merits” is one which depends upon the inherent justice of the defendant’s contention, as shown by the substantial facts of the case, as distinguished from one which rests upon technical objections or some collateral matter …
http://thelawdictionary.org/merits/
defence on the merits, peremptory defence, meritorious defense = défense au fond, défense sur le fond
http://www.btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-fra.html?la...
Mrs. Gardner, the meritorious plaintiff, was entitled to sue in her own name, for her own property, as she had been declared by a decree of the court, made more...
https://books.google.ca/books?id=wQRAAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA246&lpg=P...
…Louisa Keller, the meritorious plaintiff,…
https://books.google.ca/books?id=LAH0AAAAMAAJ&pg=PA305&lpg=P...
https://books.google.ca/books?id=EUvuEEnKtYEC&pg=PA144&lpg=P...
https://www.google.ca/search?tbm=bks&hl=fr&q=what is a "meri...
http://thelawdictionary.org/merits/
defence on the merits, peremptory defence, meritorious defense = défense au fond, défense sur le fond
http://www.btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-fra.html?la...
Mrs. Gardner, the meritorious plaintiff, was entitled to sue in her own name, for her own property, as she had been declared by a decree of the court, made more...
https://books.google.ca/books?id=wQRAAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA246&lpg=P...
…Louisa Keller, the meritorious plaintiff,…
https://books.google.ca/books?id=LAH0AAAAMAAJ&pg=PA305&lpg=P...
https://books.google.ca/books?id=EUvuEEnKtYEC&pg=PA144&lpg=P...
https://www.google.ca/search?tbm=bks&hl=fr&q=what is a "meri...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you"
+1
37 mins
(US/civ.) plaintiff(s) at the full-trial stage
if post-référé, namely post-interlocutory.
demanderesse: woman plainitiff (E&W = claimant) or corporate plaintiffs
demanderesse: woman plainitiff (E&W = claimant) or corporate plaintiffs
Reference:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/law_patents/90323-le_juge_au_fond_statuant_au_fond.html
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A9f%C3%A9r%C3%A9_en_droit_fran%C3%A7ais
Peer comment(s):
agree |
AllegroTrans
: most probably but could be "in the lower Court"
52 mins
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indeed - a full-blown trial. at the post-interim or post-interlocutory stage, would routinely stay in the same court in virtually every French-speaking country.
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neutral |
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
: I think we need the rest of the sentence before the phrasing can be determined. It is likely that "at trial" would be used rather than "at the full trial stage". We need more context. //You've missed my point, but never mind. See my 2nd discussion post.
2 hrs
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I did comment 'if post-référé, namely post-interlocutory'. I assumed that there had been an audience 'en référé' whilst I am grateful to you for forcing the contextual issue.//I take your 'at trial' point. Anything else?/OK - when in doubt, leave out, PG
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disagree |
Daryo
: the notion of "au fond" is about what is being considered [the object of the litigation as opposed to questions of procedure] + demanderesse is not always a woman plaintiff but could be any plaintiff [la partie demanderesse=the party that is suing]
10 hrs
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Then post your own answer. BTW, demanderesse is not short for partie demanderesse (plaintiff has two fs)and your procedural issues point, whilst muddled, does suggest an interlocutory antecedent.
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agree |
Charles Eddy
: Agree with Nikki that "at trial" might be better, but I do think it is in the sense of "in the court below", "in the trial court", etc. (and not in the sense of a judgment on the merits or facts) that the text used the term.
665 days
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Reference comments
1 hr
Reference:
Meaning of "au fond"
More context would be helpful but you need to be clear on the meaning of "au fond". This term relates to the "merits" of a case. In this particular situation, from the limited context, the applicant, clamant, plaintiff (the term will vary according to context), is being heard on the merits of her case.
http://www.juripole.fr/traduction-juridique/Bulletins/mai-ju...
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-05-15 00:54:25 GMT)
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Perhaps I did not make it clear enough, but this post is a reference post and is made with the intention of providing a source for the meaning of "au fond". The aim is to help this Akser in her understanding of her term, but also bearing in mind others who may consult the glossary for the temr "au fond". That is why I clearly mentionned that "demanderesse" can be rendered in a number of ways (without being specific). The essential point of this post is the notion of "merits" for "au fond". That is where the difficulty of understanding no doubt lies.
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-05-15 00:58:16 GMT)
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The specific point, if it is helpful to go down that road, is that the case has reached the point where the court is considering the merits of the case. Technical and procedural matters etc (la forme) are not the focus at this particular instant, but rather the merits (le fond).
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-05-15 01:02:29 GMT)
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http://www.dictionnaire-juridique.com/definition/fond.php
Dans le langage de la procédure on parle du "juge du fond" pour désigner la juridiction qui a compétence pour décider des demandes des parties relativement à l'objet du litige. A l'opposé :
se trouvent d'une part, le "juge des référés" qui est le juge de l'urgence et qui ne statue qu'au provisoire (dans le jargon du palais on dit que les ordonnances du juge des référés " ne préjudicient pas au principal "). Sa décision ne s'impose ni à lui-même, ni aux juridictions de première instance (Tribunaux d'instance, Tribunaux de grande instance, Tribunaux de commerce etc.)ni aux Cours d'appel,
et d'autre part, la Cour de cassation devant laquelle on tient la preuve matérielle des faits comme étant acquise et dont la fonction est d'apprécier si la décision (ordonnance, jugement ou arrêt)qui lui est déférée par le demandeur au pourvoi est conforme au Droit.
De même encore, le tribunal qui sans trancher une partie du principal ordonne une mesure d'instruction, comme une expertise ou une enquête, ne statue pas sur le fond du litige, d'où l'expression du jugement précisant que, dans ce cas, le juge a statué "avant dire droit". Les décisions de justice qui ne statuent pas "au fond" n'acquièrent pas l'autorité de la chose jugée.
http://www.juripole.fr/traduction-juridique/Bulletins/mai-ju...
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-05-15 00:54:25 GMT)
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Perhaps I did not make it clear enough, but this post is a reference post and is made with the intention of providing a source for the meaning of "au fond". The aim is to help this Akser in her understanding of her term, but also bearing in mind others who may consult the glossary for the temr "au fond". That is why I clearly mentionned that "demanderesse" can be rendered in a number of ways (without being specific). The essential point of this post is the notion of "merits" for "au fond". That is where the difficulty of understanding no doubt lies.
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-05-15 00:58:16 GMT)
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The specific point, if it is helpful to go down that road, is that the case has reached the point where the court is considering the merits of the case. Technical and procedural matters etc (la forme) are not the focus at this particular instant, but rather the merits (le fond).
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-05-15 01:02:29 GMT)
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http://www.dictionnaire-juridique.com/definition/fond.php
Dans le langage de la procédure on parle du "juge du fond" pour désigner la juridiction qui a compétence pour décider des demandes des parties relativement à l'objet du litige. A l'opposé :
se trouvent d'une part, le "juge des référés" qui est le juge de l'urgence et qui ne statue qu'au provisoire (dans le jargon du palais on dit que les ordonnances du juge des référés " ne préjudicient pas au principal "). Sa décision ne s'impose ni à lui-même, ni aux juridictions de première instance (Tribunaux d'instance, Tribunaux de grande instance, Tribunaux de commerce etc.)ni aux Cours d'appel,
et d'autre part, la Cour de cassation devant laquelle on tient la preuve matérielle des faits comme étant acquise et dont la fonction est d'apprécier si la décision (ordonnance, jugement ou arrêt)qui lui est déférée par le demandeur au pourvoi est conforme au Droit.
De même encore, le tribunal qui sans trancher une partie du principal ordonne une mesure d'instruction, comme une expertise ou une enquête, ne statue pas sur le fond du litige, d'où l'expression du jugement précisant que, dans ce cas, le juge a statué "avant dire droit". Les décisions de justice qui ne statuent pas "au fond" n'acquièrent pas l'autorité de la chose jugée.
Peer comments on this reference comment:
neutral |
Adrian MM. (X)
: applicant would be at the preceding injunctive stage whilst injunctions are uncommon in the US (because of the First Amendment to the American Constitution) and where the asker is.
8 mins
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This is a ref post on the meaning of "au fond". As indicated, the term for plaintiff etc will vary according to context, the idea being that would the info given here for "au fond" applies to more than one country and more than one situation.
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agree |
writeaway
7 hrs
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agree |
mchd
8 hrs
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agree |
Daryo
: it's a basic concept; no need to get lost is loosely related details
9 hrs
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Discussion
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jugement_sur_le_fond_en_France
It's a legacy of the Roman empire, where every trial started by parties and judges arguing about the procedure that will have to be followed, and only in a second stage examining the "meritum" i.e. the object of the dispute [the merits of the case].
As Nikki pointed out, it might not be necessary to translate the "au fond" part if it's obvious from the context that "la [partie] demanderesse" is the one party that is the initial plaintiff, [although there is probably a good reason why this party was referred to as "demanderesse au fond" and not simply "demanderesse"]
- unncessary to translate the idea of "au fond" as the context of the hearing itself makes it clear
- if it is necessary, then the actual phrasing will become clearer
It is the context of the prhasing of the sentence which will really help. It is unlikely in a court document that the descriptive "at full-trial stage" would be used. "At trial" is more likely and that too is descriptive, but it probably so obvious that nothing at all would be said. If something is mentionned, for the reason Alain states, the same court sitting for a different purpose, if that purpose needs to be made clear, the phrase "full-trial stage" is not formal legalese and is not the type of phrasing that would be used from my limited experience, experience which is UK (England and Wales) and not US.
Please could you provide some context? It would be helpful to have the complete sentence, made anonymous of course. A few words of general background would not go amiss either and a couple of sentences preceiding and following your extract would be best of all!
In context, although the meaning of "au fond" is important, it may even turn out that it is not necessary to translate it at all and that "plaintiff, claimant, applicant" with the surrounding context, will be fine. For the moment, it is a little too mysterious! ;-)